WILLIAM BUHLMAN: “If you enjoy the Afterlife TV near-death experience interviews, you’ll really enjoy this down-to-earth guest who has learned to leave his body intentionally innumerable times for more than 40 years. William Buhlman shares with us what it’s like for our consciousness to exit our body, how simple this is to do (with commitment & persistence), and what we can learn about life and the afterlife by having this experience. William’s intelligence and analytical nature takes out-of-body insight to whole new level.
“William describes how we are multidimensional beings, how OBEs are actually experiencing a duplicate reality, how our human beliefs affect our experiences (including our initial afterlife experiences), how we can see our loved ones in spirit during OBEs, and how leaving our body shifts us inward (not outward) to our true essence as non-physical, creative, spiritual beings. William Buhlman finally discusses how his early OBEs eliminated his fear of death and how these experiences can actually prepare us for death. There’s so much more that we discussed that teaches how to live more fully, it’s an episode I believe everyone will enjoy.” ~ Bob Olson, Afterlife TV
If you’d like to watch this video, Out of Body Experience: Discover Your Spiritual Essence by Leaving Your Body – Interview with William Buhlman, visit www.afterlifetv.com/?p=2176
Afterlife TV is presented by Afterlife Investigator & Psychic Medium Researcher Bob Olson, who is the author of Answers about the Afterlife: A Private Investigator’s 15-Year Research Unlocks the Mysteries of Life after Death.
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Bob: Hey everybody, Bob Olson here with Afterlife TV, you could find us at afterlifetv.com is where we search for evidence of life after death, and ask the meaningful questions around that subject. Today, we’re going to be talking about leaving your body. Boy, this is a fascinating subject actually, it’s something that anyone of us can do if we really want to and try and have a little persistence. But what is that experience like and what does it mean? What can we learn from it? Our expert today has… he’s been having out-of-body experiences purposely for over 40 years, first one in 1972. He is an expert, he has written a couple of books that we’re going to talk about here specifically about this, and his name is William Buhlman. Welcome William to Afterlife TV.
William: Thank you, it’s a pleasure to be here.
Bob: Just so, there are people and we love these people, they’re new to this. Haven’t even heard of an out-of-body experience, also known as an OBE. Why don’t you just tell people who don’t know what’s an out-of-body experience?
William: Well, an out-of-body experience is essentially the separation of consciousness from the body. And it can be spontaneous during sleep or it can be self initiated. And these experiences have been recorded since the beginning of history. So, there’s nothing new about them, they’re just becoming rediscovered in the modern age more and more.
Bob: I know you had one and I’m going to talk about it. What are your beliefs and your mindset before you had your experience, where were you all about all this kind of stuff?
William: Well, it’s a good question. I was young at that time, this was over 40 years ago and I was in college. And a friend of mine has an spontaneous out-of-body experience and it changed him, changed his perception of reality and I wanted to… I was an agnostic or an atheist essentially.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And I didn’t believe in any afterlife, I didn’t believe in non-physical reality. I though this physical world is it. And he said to me that this experience proved to him that he continue. And that was just incredibly exciting to me, so I found that there were techniques that were available to self initiate an out-of-body experience. I studied a book on it and I decided to make a 30-day commitment to do the technique. Even though I was a believer, I had no knowledge of metaphysics, nothing. But I said, “What the heck, if he can have this experience why can’t I?” So, I did this technique which today I called the Target Technique. And on the 24th day it took a lot of perseverance. It took 24 days of daily practice of this technique. And on the 24th day I was laying in a single bed against the wall and I woke and I felt different. And when I reached out my hand, my hand actually entered wall. And that’s when it hit me, “Oh my god.” I was so excited. It’s real.
Bob: Yeah.
William: It’s beautiful. And I thought of standing and the next thing I knew I was standing by my body, totally logically thinking, totally aware, making decisions, not a dream. And I moved around a little bit, it was a brief experience, but it was enough to prove to me beyond the shadow of a doubt that this is real. We have the ability to leave our physical body and explore this parallel energy of reality. And I also began to realize that there’s other beings, of course, that live there that have died. And this was just… it just changed everything, my entire perception of reality, everything changed. Suddenly, it’s like you’re reborn almost into a new reality. You have million, I had a million questions that needed to be answered and it’s just an exciting thing to realize and get this personal verification.
Bob: Yeah, you know, it reminds me of my first reading with a medium because I went very skeptical, “What the hell.” We ended up being through this reading that all kinds of evidence came through, take that to the degree a hundred times. If I had an experience like this it will just completely blow my mind. I can’t even imagine. I was enthusiastic about the reading. That must have just been amazing. I have to ask because the next day after my reading I called a couple of people up and I was telling them about it. How about you? Did you feel like you wanted to do that?
William: Oh, yeah and I did. And I quickly found out that people are pretty closed-minded, especially 40 years ago it was like… people were like, “You did what?”
Bob: Yeah.
William: It’s like, people if it doesn’t jive with their personal experience they question it. And it brought me down to earth real quick because I realized that you really couldn’t share these types of experiences with everyone because some people just found it so far away from reality for them that they wouldn’t even want to listen to it.
Bob: Totally, yeah.
William: And it’s unfortunate.
Bob: Oh, it is unfortunate. A wake up call for me too. I called my mother and I called a good buddy of mine, I told them both and the best I get out of them was, “Well, I believe that you believe it.”
William: Yeah, exactly.
Bob: Okay, All right. Now, I’m getting how these works. But I was just telling them about this reading again, and they would have thought I was hallucinating or something if I told them your experience. So, this is really cool. I am also very impressed with the tenacity, the persistence that is required to do this night after night for 24 nights before you finally have an experience. I don’t even know where this comes from. I mean you think calling, you think this is definitely what you came here to do. But who knows? But it’s just amazing that you were able to do it, so you must have felt pretty good that it finally happened. And now, I imagine you’re excited to do another one?
William: Well, I’ve had many experiences over the last 40 years. I found, once you had one I became hooked. I don’t know what else to say. I knew I could do it and then I wanted to learn more. It’s about obtaining knowledge.
Bob:Yeah.
William: This is about obtaining true knowledge, not some book theories. I mean you become an explorer of consciousness. And that’s what I try to teach people today, become an explorer. Don’t accept belief systems. Find out. We have the capacity. You know what’s strange to me is that in the Western World, 98% of the entire population believes in an afterlife, or I forgot the exact percentage.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But vast majority believed that we continue and that we are non-physical or spiritual beings. If we’re non-physical beings why do we have to wait until we die to experience what we are?
Bob: Yeah.
William: It’s silly. We are non-physical/spiritual beings then that’s what we are, we should be able to experience our true self whenever we choose.
Bob: You and I were talking a little bit before the show here about so many people, right now. I mean, it’s almost the fad people are so interested in near-death experiences. And part of the near-death experience not for everybody, but for many people is the out-of-body experience. They immediately leave their body, they see their body, they sit in there and etc, etc. Well, here is a way for all of us to share, to have that experience, and yet, I’ve been a little bit fascinated how there is less interest in this subject matter than there is in NDEs. I don’t know what that’s about, do you?
William: No, I find it’s very strange. Number one, all near-death experiences 100%, the first major element is an OBE. So, number one is essential element of the experience. Number two, OBEs are far more prevalent, we don’t even know how many.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But there’s many times, 20-30 times more prevalent. There are natural phenomena occurring worldwide that are people having these OBEs, they are reproducible.
Bob: Thank you.
William: That is what important about an OBE. Nobody wants to reproduce an NDE.
Bob: That’s right.
William: No one. But OBEs are reproducible and that’s where the knowledge is gained, we can use it almost like a scientific study. If you have repeated experiences you can begin and this what my goal was, to obtain knowledge. Observable, objectable knowledge of this non-physical reality that we call spirit. I think all of these terms are obsolete, it is non-physical reality. We are non-physical beings beginning to experience our true home and environment. We’re not physical. And we’re only here for a short period of time and everybody should be able to see that.
Bob: Yeah.
William: So, OBE is a natural path to us obtaining knowledge of ourselves.
Bob: That’s right. And we talked about the fact that like you said, they’re spontaneous and near-death experiences are spontaneous. A lot of times they happen once maybe twice or a few times in a lifetime to somebody. This is something that we can induce, we can make happen. And in your case, whatever a 40 years’ of experiences, I think I heard you say in an interview once, over a thousand of experiences, probably a lot more, and not only do you get to… you’re not shocked by it like people who are in NDEs.
William: Yeah.
Bob: But you now keep trying different ways and testing different things, that’s what I loved about reading your book was to see how you sort of systemically, “I’m going to try this.” “Oh wow, that works.” “I’m going to do that again.” And you keep trying different things and learning about it every single time you have a new one. That really makes this subject matter exciting.
William: Well, it’s very exciting because everyone can do this. This is a natural state. This is not unusual. This is something recorded in the Bible, in the Quran. Every religious tradition talks about this. They just have different terminologies like, I was in the spirit or things… but what did that mean?
Bob: Right.
William: That is what important here. This is an exploration of consciousness in non-physical reality, that where we can obtain the answers and that’s why it’s so critically important especially today where people are claimed to beliefs.
Bob: Yeah, that’s right, yeah. All right. So, let’s back up a little bit to your first experience. And anytime if you want to interject, “Okay. That was my first experience, but today this is a little bit different or something like that.” Interject other experiences is fine, but this was interesting, I love to pick it apart a little bit. So, you’re first experience… I have a little quote here, “As I drifted off to sleep I dreamt that I was sitting in a round table with several people. They all seemed to be asking me questions related to myself development and state of consciousness.” Who are these people and what was this all about? Any idea now that your in the highest light?
William: Yes, because it’s a projection. When we leave our physical bodies we’re entering into a thought responsive dimensional reality. This is what we know now. We know it for a fact. People sometimes forget when we die and when we leave our body there is no air. You don’t have a biological body anymore. There’s no gravity. The law of physics are all different. What happens is we end up… we have experiences of projections of different aspects of ourselves.
Bob: Yeah.
William: There’s not one type of experience. That’s one thing I’d like to get across. There’s millions of kinds of experiences and it all depends on your own state of consciousness. And you will be communicating with yourself through various means. Some people call it the projection. But whatever it maybe we have to start to look at the laws of the universe differently, because the non-physical laws of reality are far different than the laws of physical physics.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And that is what’s important here. So, everything. We have to begin to learn how to function in this thought responsive non-physical reality and begin to communicate in different ways than we used to in the past. And we communicate with ourselves also in different ways. So, there are different perceptions based again on your, let’s just call it your perception and your level of, let’s just say development in a non-physical state.
Bob: Yeah. You might know, I know she started to teach at the Monroe Institute where you’ve been teaching for years. Natalie Sudman, she had a very unique near-death experience. And she was talking very similar. As soon as she left her body she found herself on the stage in front of thousands of beings, spiritual beings, light beings. They’re all wearing robes, which is kind of interesting. You guys have some similarities to your stories. In this case you drifted off to sleep and you are at this round table with several people. I asked her, she had to think about it before she gave me the answer. But I said, “Do you think you were already there on that stage downloading?” She says she was downloading information about her lifetime to these beings. “Do you think you’re already there and you just became aware of it after this bomb went off?” And she said, “Yes, I do.”
William: Yeah.
Bob: Same thing with you? Do you think you’re already at this table, but you just became aware of it?
William: Yes, because we’re multidimensional-beings, that’s one thing we have learned from tens of thousands of out-of-body experiences. Is that we are multidimensional beings, this childish concept of body, mind, spirit is obsolete. We’re far more complex than that, than this childhood story. We are multidimensional. We have many energy bodies. And the physical world is a thin epidermis, the outer layer of the universe. Our body is a vehicle of consciousness that we are using for temporary period of time. When you have an out-of-body experience or near-death experience, you are shifting your conscious awareness inwardly to a less dense more subtle energy body. Yes, these realities already are there. We are already there, but we are not aware of them because we’re totally focused on this biological vehicle.
Bob: Yeah, yeah.
William: But once… same applies to meditation.
Bob: Yeah.
William: As you meditate, many meditators… there are books on this where they would leave their body, but they used different terms.
Bob: Right.
William: But it’s the same. They’re shifting their conscious awareness inwardly within a more subtle energy body within themselves. And there are many different energy bodies and we already exist there. That’s what’s so exciting about this, we’re multidimensional. All of life is multidimensional. And we only see less than 1% of reality, and yet we think this is it.
Bob: Well, I mean people have a hard enough time understanding the mind, body, spirit still to this day. So, this is great mind blowing stuff. You used… I saw an interview where you did… you talked about the analogy of using an apple, the skin on the apple. Do you remember that? I thought that was perfect.
William: That’s pretty accurate. That’s how the physical reality. And we know this is not a theory. This is based on tens of thousands of out-of-body experiences from every country on the planet. When you leave your body you move inward, you are moving, you are shifting your awareness to a less dense part of the universe. It’s another dimensional and you move through a membrane, there’s a divisional point, which I call “membrane.” But the physical world is thin as the skin of an apple.
Bob: And we move inward rather than outward, we always think we’re going out.
William: There’s no out. That’s why the term out-of-body is unfortunately has become the popular term, but it’s actually not a very accurate term.
Bob: Not right, yeah. We have a lot of those. We have a lot of those in this field.
William: Don’t we?
Bob: Past life’s…
William: Yeah.
Bob: I hear from past life to other lives not past life, all of these kinds of things. But all right. The next thing you wrote was that you began to feel dizzy and a strange numbness like Novocaine began to spread throughout your body, upon which you passed out and hit your head on a table. Was this the vibrational state that you’re talking about?
William: Yeah.
Bob: It is. So, tell us about that.
William: Yes, the vibrational state is what we call today, it’s the common prelude to an outer body experience. It involves vibrations, numbness, sounds, loud buzzing in the ears are very common, temporary paralysis of the body, very common. Because you have to begin to disconnect from the physical to have these non-physical experience. That’s why the physical body is para… but people freak out about these things. There’s a lot of loud noises. There’s a lot of strange phenomena that’s occurring. And this is what scares people, they’re not knowledgeable. Our society is not trained people in how to prepare for these events. So, they’re considered alien or strange events. Then fear grows, and then you block.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But once you realize this is all natural, and you begin, like I used the term Novocaine I also talked about sounds like, I’m in a jet engine. The vibrations are incredibly loud sometimes.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And every person’s experience is different, but in all of this phenomena is generally called the vibrational state. Because there’s almost always like an electrical like vibration of some sort moving through what feels like your body, but it’s not, it’s your non-physical body. You’re beginning to transfer your full conscious awareness to your non-physical body that already exists. And this process can be startling to the neophyte.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And this is what I’ve been trying to get across for 40 years to people, not to be afraid of something so natural.
Bob: Yeah, yeah, if they cannot be afraid of that they cannot block the rest of the experience and allow it to keep going. I’ve experienced this… I bet a lot of people have, probably a lot of people have done it with meditation. I’ve never been very good at that, but I’ve had guided imagery, guided meditation, body work and like regressions. Past life regressions, life between life regressions, but one of the things that always happens to me is my hands, my fingers and hands start to go numb and if I can imagine this at all, I imagine it’s somewhat what I feel in my hands and fingers, but throughout the whole body. When you talked about the paralysis there’s a scary word right there, but…
William: Yes.
Bob: But aside from that, I imagine this is a necessary part of the process. Why is that? Maybe a good part because your body is not going to be moving around, you’re not going to fall out of bed. Do you have any idea why that happens? Just because you’re leaving and it’s almost like…
William: I think it’s a safety mechanism that’s built in with us, so that we don’t… let’s face it you have to at some point disconnect.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Otherwise you would be out of control on both levels of reality.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And I think it’s part of the natural body instinct to go through the process. Now, I like to emphasize not everybody has all this and it varies from person to person. In my books I go into a great detail because 75% of people do have the vibrational state. And by the way, children have it especially.
Bob: Oh, cool.
William: And it freaks out parents. It does and they don’t know what to do about it and they end up… you wouldn’t believe the amount of letters I’ve gotten where children are on drugs because they are having these states.
Bob: Oh, wow.
William: Because the doctors, of course, are only going to look at it from a biological viewpoint.
Bob: Yeah.
William: My point is that this is a common and normal phenomena that’s occurring, and that some people it occurs more to. No one knows why. But we have to become educated about this subject and not just reach some ridiculous conclusion based on some external belief system.
Bob: Yeah.
William: We have to deal… that’s the key here. We have to become knowledgeable in order to become… in other words, this is part of our evolutionary cycle I feel.
Bob: Yeah.
William: We’re evolving inwardly. We’re evolving to be non-physical creative spiritual beings, and this is part of the process of this evolution. And unless we become educated, we will always be stagnant in a society, in a culture.
Bob: Yes, that’s right. And there are so many other benefits to it. I mean, you said one of the first benefits you gained from it was just simply, you no longer fear death, that’s huge.
William: Absolutely, there is no fear of death.
Bob: Yeah.
William: You know, you have the verification if your going to continue. And that is important, but that’s just the beginning of the knowledge that’s available. That’s what is truly exciting.
Bob: Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, going back to it. So, at first I just want to say, I actually… it reduces my fear to think that there’s this built-in component of the vibrational state to keep my body from doing something stupid while I’m traveling around. So, there’s a good thing there. Are there any sounds or smells or taste that accompany the OBEs that are different for every person like all of the other spiritually experiences?
William: Yes, it’s different for every person, even by different cultures. But what is universal is some of the things I shared. There’s generally some type of vibration. There’s often there’s a paralysis. There’s often a floating sensation. Parts of your legs or arms will begin to float off, that’s common, or sinking. In some cultures it’s more of a sinking sensation. In Shamanic cultures they would sink down to mother earth or Pachamama. Where in Western cultures it would be more of a lifting others, but it’s a separation that is beginning to occur. Seeing through close eyelids, by the way is very common. You are laying in bed, your eyes are closed, but you can see your environment. What is that mean?
Bob: Yeah.
William: You’re seeing through your non-physical vision and people don’t even get it. They’re laying there. You know what that means, your already out-of-body.
Bob: Yeah, yeah.
William: You just have to activate the separation response.
Bob: Right.
William: And that’s where people don’t know what to do, or they don’t know what it means to them, that’s why it’s so important to get this knowledge out there that this is not only universal, but it’s natural. It’s 100% natural because we’re non-physical beings.
Bob: Oh, yeah. When I prepared for these interviews, I prepare for the two days prior. And so I’m just focused on this for two days. So, last night just before bed, finishing something up on my laptop, I stand up to go put my laptop on my bureau, and all of the sudden I don’t know what was going on, and probably had nothing to do with this, but I felt like I was numb. And I felt like, when I was moving it was like moving through water. Everything was like really, really hard to get my legs to move. And I thought, “Oh, crap.” I rushed back to bed. “I’m going to have one of this.” And I’m telling myself, “Out-of-body now, out-of-body now.” I’m trying to focus using your target technique, I just fell to sleep. But I was excited, there was a possibility for it. It can happen to some people. Right?
William: It can happen to anybody that’s willing to take the time. This is no different than meditation.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Nobody becomes a Buddha for practicing for a week.
Bob: Right.
William: And unfortunately, this is what happened. It’s the same kind of process. I consider this a lifetime program.
Bob: Yeah.
William: To me, my out-of-body meditations are the same as what any meditator would do. I just have a different intention and goal, but my process is the same as any meditator. You steal the mind. You deep breathe. I count myself down. It’s the same kind of thing that meditators doing worldwide. The only difference that what I do and teach is that I have a real focused intention on the end result. But it’s the same process and it takes perseverance, it takes daily training because we’re reprograming our mind to have a new conscious ability.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Just like meditation.
Bob: Well, your early experiences described where you would fall asleep and then you would wake-up, and you get-up and go on the couch, and do a little reading, and so you’re sleepy again before you start to try to make this happen. And do you still do that or you don’t need to do that anymore?
William: No, I still do it. I use the same thing I did 40 years ago. I found that doing these techniques in your bed is a least effective place to do now.
Bob: Why is that?
William: Because we’re programed to sleep sound. We’re like the old saying, “Sleep like a log.” Those days are gone. I don’t want to sleep like a log. I want to become consciously aware while my body sleeps.
Bob: Right.
William: It’s 180-degree difference. That’s why I found move…. I use myself up as my exploration area. And I have a designated exploration area. I lay to bed, I go to the sofa, I have everything ready there. I keep the house as warm. I’m prepared and I focus on my intention. And that is what works.
Bob: Yeah. I’m going to mention a couple of things. One, I’m going to mention… I’m going to start with this book “Adventures Beyond the Body: How to Experience Out-of-Body Travel.” This is your first book, is it not?
William: Yes.
Bob: Your first book… was this… 1996 I think it came out, right?
William: Yes, I wrote it ’94 and it was finally published in ’96 published.
Bob: Yeah, that’s how it works.
William: It took a while.
Bob: This is why books on…
William: …Buying it, which I was surprised.
Bob: Well, there you go and I’m so glad that they did because… and look it’s still being sold. It’s still out there. It’s bound to be… if it’s already, it’s a classic. I know a lots of people have read it. You go on, you read the reviews, people are loving this book. It was how I was first attracted to you a long time ago, and knew that I’ll be interviewing you one day, just reading the reviews about how this book has changed people’s lives. You also though, you have taken it much further and you’re now in the Monroe Institute, you teach almost a week long workshop. What’s this about?
William: Yes, I teach 6-day long very intensive program and it’s called Out-of-Body Intensive at the Monroe Institute, it’s residential. The Monroe Institute by the way is the premiere place in the world for the exploration of consciousness as I’m sure you know, many people go there, it’s all about the exploration of consciousness. Only 24 people at a time can attend and everybody is on their own check unit. They’re laying down in their check units and I’m speaking to them and doing live techniques with Hemi-Sync brain synchronization music and I do meditations. And I’m speaking to them into their unit through headphones.
Bob: That’s so unique.
William: It is. It’s very advance, it’s the place to explore consciousness. And it works for many, many people. But it’s exciting because this is… I teach no belief systems. I teach no religiousness associated with this. We approach it from a scientific viewpoint and an experiential viewpoint. This what we have experienced. There is no extraneous bull added.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And that is so common today and I think it’s very important to separate that. It’s all based on the individual’s experience, and having your own experience, and that’s what’s powerful. But it’s an exiting program, it’s all we sold out of course because it’s only so few people can go.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But Monroe Institute if I can put in a word here, it is… so, many great programs at Monroe… I’m just one of the teachers there. There’s great programs there for the exploration of consciousness.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Cutting edge programs whether it would be past lives, future lives, or just the flat out exploration of the big quote, “What am I?” “Where did I come from?” “Where am I going?” “What’s my purpose?”
Bob: Yeah.
William:These are the questions we want to answer at the Monroe Institute.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And that’s why it’s worth, go to monroeinstitute.com and check it out for yourself.
Bob: Yeah.
William: It’s just great, great institute.
Bob: I like the idea that everybody is in their own dormitory room and they get to listen. I do my… like I said, my best through guided visualization kind of a thing and sounds like similar. Probably everybody that does this kind of work usually hates this question, but I’m going to ask you anyways because my audience is wondering, so what percentage roughly, I’m sure it changes every class, of people actually have an experience during those six days?
William: It really varies. It’s difficult to say exactly the percentage because not everybody shares.
Bob: Oh, yeah. Okay.
William: Well, this is a very personal experience to begin with. As a matter of fact, a lot of people they come up to me and say, “I’ve never told anybody this, but this happen.” I hear this all the time. They can’t share this even with their families sometimes because they’re looked at like they’re loosing their minds.
Bob: That’s right.
William: I couldn’t give you a percentage.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But the opportunity is there. I do 24 different distinct hour-long techniques.
Bob: Oh, wow. That’s a lot.
William: The people have every opportunity in it. And at night I wake everybody up and we do a technique, even in the middle of the night.
Bob: Oh, my goodness.
William: Because that is often the best time to do it.
Bob: I see. And the greatest thing about it is that… like you, it took you 24 tries to finally get it, but they’re now prepared. They now know how to do it. They can go home and they know exactly what they need to do.
William: Yeah, a lot of this is of course, one of my goals is to train them on all the aspects of these that they are comfortable with the process. And that’s really important because the average person is clueless.
Bob: Yeah.
William: They’re clueless. These words like spirit and God mean nothing in the preparation of us moving towards the afterlife.
Bob: Yeah.
William: These old terms are not preparation, they’re not helping anyone really.
Bob: Yeah.
Bob: Providing hope, but they’re not preparing somebody for a non-physical thought responsive universe that we enter when we all die.
Bob: Yeah.
William: The time has come for us to mature the conversation, and for us to become educated because there’s no doubt we’re all headed to a non-physical environment.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Call it spiritual, give it any label you want. But wouldn’t be nice to know what’s going on, instead of just hoping that things work out?
Bob: Totally.
William: I mean, those days are gone. We live in an age where we have tens of thousands of OBEs that given us a lot of insight into this subject matter. But each individual has to take the effort to learn.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And take off the hood.
Bob: Right.
William: And let’s get out of the dark ages. And let’s learn the facts of what’s going on, and then have your own experience. Don’t believe anybody. I want to share this briefly.
Bob: Yeah.
William: I don’t want you to believe me.
Bob: Yeah.
William: This is not a belief. I don’t want you to believe me. I challenge you to find out for yourself. Do the techniques yourself. I didn’t believe it. Do the techniques yourself. Do it for 30 days. And then you determine what’s real. Nobody’s trying to sway you or slant your opinion. I could care less. If this is about personal experience because that’s where knowledge is gained, not from a book.
Bob: Right. Exactly, exactly. Well, yeah. I actually agree, I just did whatever 60 interviews or something to promote my book and I started off almost everyone of them by saying the exact thing you just said, which is great, but it also takes people so that they could relax a little. Okay, he is not trying to push anything down my throat, he is just sharing with me what is possible. So, let’s talk a little bit more about this and encourage people to have this experience. Go back to the first one, but you don’t have to just focus on that one. So, you get through the vibrational state and one of the first things you recognize is the wall in front of you. Tell us a little bit about that. You reach out for the wall. Right? You can feel it?
William: Well, yes. I reached out my hand, which of course, it feels. Let me share this real briefly. The non-physical out-of-body experience is not some airy fairy Tinker Bell type of thing, and many people seem to have this concept out there that’s so prevalent, that you’re going to float off and you’re going to be like a little angel. None of that is… that’s bull. It’s very physical-like experience.
Bob: Yeah.
William: You’re entering a non-physical reality. That’s a duplicate, energy duplicate often. Depending on the state of consciousness of the individual, but 99% of the time at the beginning it will be a duplicate of the physical world. I get incredible letters from people that are having out-of-body experiences and they are walking around going to their refrigerator, and then when they try to open the refrigerator their hands goes through it. And only then do they realize that they are out-of-body.
Bob: Yeah.
William: I can’t emphasize. This is a very much a physical grounded experience. And you’re walking around in an environment. What we have discovered is that there’s a parallel world, that is almost duplicate. Energetically it’s far more subtle than the physical, but your house will look essentially the same. The colors of the walls maybe different, there maybe slight, but it’s the same. You don’t enter this cloud-like heaven.
Bob: Yeah.
William: You enter a parallel universe. That’s what I’m referring to. That’s the next energy dimension. The non-physical realm, the word spiritual is used too much. The laws of physics are not spiritual, are they?
Bob: Right.
William: Then why would the non-physical laws of the universe be spiritual? They just are. We continue to exist in this parallel world. Heaven is another reality, that’s all. We use these terms heaven, it’s a non-physical environment that we enter.
Bob: Yeah.
William: That’s created by thought and it’s very stable and very three-dimensional and solid because reality… so, the term solid is relative to the vibrational state of the participant.
Bob: Okay.
William: It’s very important. In other words, when I reached out my hand and I started to sit up, everything still looks solid to me.
Bob: Okay. And you were obviously, you were able to stand on the floor. I mean, I imagine you feel like you’re standing on the floor at least. Right?
William: Yes, yes, yes, absolutely it feels very much like the physical world in many respects.
Bob: The first time and every time after that, you see the wall in front of you, you put your hand out and you are going through the wall, is that actually the wall though or is that a wall in a different dimension?
William: It’s a wall in a different dimension.
Bob: Yeah, okay. And it is an important point, I think.
William: Yes, it is.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Because everybody thinks it was like, just one other dimension. This is what I found and it gets very… it took me 20 years to get a handle on this.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Living in a multidimensional continuum.
Bob: Yeah.
William: There is many of them, more than I know. Everybody talks about seven. No, I know better than that.
Bob: Yeah.
William: I don’t know how many dimensions there are. I’m not going to buy into some belief system because of theosophy.
Bob: Yeah.
William: I know better from experience.
Bob: Yeah.
William: There’s countless dimensions and they’re expanding it appears because of thought. Thought is the creative force. The universe is expanding because of thought. The physical universe is expanding due to thought. The non-physical universe is expanding exponentially because of thought. More and more people are creating because thought creates all of these environments. Consensus group thought creates a reality that today people call heaven.
Bob: Yeah. Okay.
William: It’s childish. It’s a thought manifested and created. A collective group of a thousand people can easily create an environment, that’s what happens.
Bob: I see. What you are saying… I mean, when you start thinking about all of these things it really makes recognize the importance of taking responsibilities for our thoughts, even in the physical world. Can you expand on that based on what you know having all this experienced? How important is it that we watch the thoughts that we have and how they maybe influencing our own lives?
William: It’s essential because we create a reality. It takes longer in the physical because the physical is the outer epidermis and it’s dense, and it’s less receptive to thought, less response. But once you leave your body that’s the first thing I learned after the overall shock of, “Oh my God, I continue.” It’s that, “Oh my God, my thoughts are powerful.”
Bob: Yeah.
William: In a non-physical reality our thoughts are king and that’s why it’s so important if you’re fear based, if you have an outer body experience, or near-death experience, may I share, and you’re fear based, what could happen? You’re going to manifest devils. You’re going to manifest hell. You’re going to manifest ungodly stuff.
Bob: Right.
William: You were the creator of it because you projected these fears. Fears come back to us and it happens quickly. In the physical world it’s slowed down. But once you leave your body everything’s happening quickly, that’s why it’s so critically important that we learn the rules of the road, the non-physical rules which are number one, you have to control your thought projection. Every thought is a projection of energy and they all have a result.
Bob: And in this way a lot of people make fun of the affirmation people and yet they’re on to something. They might not even realize how much they’re on to something from your perspective but they certainly are. The difference between saying an affirmation versus thinking and worrying about something that you don’t want to happen that you fear seems like night and day. Is there a right or wrong way of sort of using an affirmation from your perspective? Does it matter what you see in the present or the future or anything?
William: I think there is. There is a more… the most effective approach I found is to always keep it in the present tense and use the word now. Our subconscious mind only accept the reality of… and I’m talking about subconscious mind. There is no past and there is no future. It’s only now. Now, is the time of power. People forget this, you can only create now.
Bob: Yeah.
William: We can’t create anything in the past. Can’t we? There’s this lever of conscious awareness that is powerful, and that is the now. And that’s why we have to take control of it. An affirmations work if you use them properly and focus on like, now I have an outer body experience as you drift in your sleep. That’s the easiest effective way to induce an outer body experience. I mean, because it’s going if you repeat it and you repeat it like a mantra until it begins to soak into your subconscious mind. That’s the part we have to begin to activate.
Bob: And very fascinating that quite quickly, you recognize to make these demands that, for instance if everything was a little blurry or you want to see in with a great clarity, you would say something like, “Clarity now” and instantly you would have great clarity.
William: Well, I would have to repeat it sometimes. And now, I have evolved somewhat in my… now, I use awareness now.
Bob: Awareness now.
William: Because I realized that we are the creative force when we’re in a non-physical reality. And as a Shaman would say, “You own your power.” They’re doing the same thing. You are the creative force, you don’t look around and wait for somebody to interact with you. You are the energy source, the creator of that individual personal reality.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And once you own that, that’s why these affirmations work. Clarity now, if your out-of-body, and this is common experience by the way. Out-of-body explorers write to me all the time and the number one issue was lack of mobility and lack of perception or what some people call vision. Remember, we don’t have eyes in an out-of-body estate.
Bob: Right.
William: Seeing with our mind. So, it’s about clarifying our vision within ourselves. So, we have to take control of all aspects of it.
Bob: Yeah.
William: That’s what I’m trying to emphasize all the time. It’s essential.
Bob: Yeah.
William: The same thing applies in near-death experience if people had to aware with all.
Bob: Yeah.
William: You could begin to take control of this experiences to some degree if you owned it. And we’re trained in how to… the Buddhist have been doing this. The Tibetans have been doing this for thousand years. The Tibetan book of dead goes in the detail. This isn’t anything new.
Bob: Yeah.
William: We can influence our state of consciousness in every state, including the afterlife and in transition.
Bob: Yeah.
William: It’s very important to our evolution.
Bob: Definitely. Now, you brought up hell and you gave a great example of why people would have a hellish experience. In all your work have you seen any evidence of hell?
William: No.
Bob: No.
William: No, I have not seen any. Because I don’t enter this… I know better. I know better than to enter in a fear based mindset.
Bob: Yeah.
William: I know that I am the creative force in my personal experience. I’m not saying, “I can influence anyone else.” But in my experience, in my personal environment I am the energy source.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And that’s what’s important to own. So, no, I have never seen any kind of negative. I’ve never seen any of this stuff that people have heard about. Never.
Bob: You get what you’re feeling.
William: Because that’s your state of consciousness. We get what we project.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And it’s that simple. We get what we project.
Bob: Which is where beliefs can get in the way. So, if you don’t do work ahead of time and you have all of these beliefs that you might be going to hell then you could create that for yourself.
William: Absolutely and that’s what happens in these hellish near-death experiences.
Bob: Thank you, thank you.
William: I mean, come on. There’s no other… to me it’s so simple.
Bob: Yeah, yeah.
William: If you believe in hell, you can definitely experience hell.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Because you are the creative source of it.
Bob: All right. I’ll go back. We’re talking about when you saw the wall, the wall was actually in another dimension. You’re not seeing the actual physical wall. How about when you turned around, I remember the first time you actually saw your body. So, how about here now? Are you actually seeing your body or you’re seeing some aspect?
William: I’m seeing an aspect. I didn’t see my body, I saw a lump.
Bob: Okay.
William: It looked like a lump. I don’t know how else to describe it, but very few people see their bodies, because number one, you’re in another dimensional reality.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And you have to remember, you are no longer observing the physical world. This gets confusing. People to this day, people think they’re observing the physical world.
Bob: Yeah.
William: You are not. You have just shifted your attention into another distinct and separate energy dimension. And we have to remember, this gets confusing because people are still trying to relate it to the physical. And it took me years to get this.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Repeated experiences, you begin to get it.
Bob: I mean, it’s also a little confusing because of the near-death experiences a lot of who leave their body when they’re temporarily dead will look back and see their body there. We don’t really know. We don’t know. I mean, they are not able to do what you did. You just keep trying and testing and analyzing. We don’t know if they’re actually seeing their real body or not, it seems that they are because they are also aware of the doctors and nurses in the surgery room and…
William: But that’s at the very beginning stages of the experience of a near-death and an OBE.
Bob: Right.
William: Remember I said that the world is parallel.
Bob: Yeah.
William: My surroundings are still physical. If I have people around me, those people will still be there.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But I’m going to be observing the non-physical aspect of them.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And they’ll still look the same. So, yes, during an OBE people report seeing nurses and doctors and things like that during their experiences.
Bob: Yeah.
William: It’s very common and even hearing conversations.
Bob: Yeah, yeah. I’m trying to pick my questions here because I only have so much time. I know that… so, at the next point you are looking at the wall and the next thing you recognize your seeing sort of through at the wall face and there’s a green field extending beyond the room. Did you ever get to the point where… obviously you did, but talk about how you were… at first it was sort of spontaneously you’re seeing a field in the first one, but now you can pretty much see and go anywhere you want?
William: As long as you keep calm and that’s what I always stress. You have to focus and maintain… I used techniques to accomplish this.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Once I leave my body I instruct everybody to move 10 feet away from their body because it’s almost like a gravity that pulls you back.
Bob: Okay.
William: Many people who will relate to this have had the experience like you’re being pulled. You move 10 feet away and then you center your energy field by using awareness now. You repeat an affirmation that centers your energy field. You’re locking in your full awareness. Remember we’re multidimensional beings. Our awareness is only at our soul level, or in our subconscious level, or in our intellectual level, or in the astral level, or in our physical level. Our consciousness is not in one place. It spreads over continuum.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And this is one thing that science is yet to discover. Even when you leave your body, your body is being maintained automatically. So, a portion of you is doing this.
Bob: Yeah.
William: My point is we’re multidimensional. You focus, you center your awareness and then you begin to gain control over that energy body.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And that’s when you have the ability to take control. You can walk, you can move through walls, you can move… I call it multidimensionally. You can begin to use your thoughts. That’s where it takes… for many people it takes years to gain control because you have to gain control of a non-physical energy body. And it’s capabilities which are incredible.
Bob: Yeah.
William: At first, you’re like a child learning how the new rules of the roads work.
Bob: Yeah.
William: You have to get out of the crib.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And then you have to learn to walk.
Bob: Yeah. There was two things…
William: And that’s what it feels like.
Bob: There was two things that seems to bring you back into your body, which would end the experience for that evening at least or whatever at that moment. One was fear, “Oh, I’m fearful.” And the other one was thinking about your body.
William: Yeah.
Bob: So, as you think about it now that your focus and boom, you’re back in it.
William: And that is an obstacle. The only one rule in outer body exploration is never think of your body. It’s very simple. There’s no rules. It’s just that. Because any thought of your body and you’ll immediately be back in your body.
Bob: Wow.
William: And that takes training, and that’s the biggest thing you have to train yourself to do. That’s why I always teach people to get involved in your new environment.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Become immersed in the new environment, pretend your body doesn’t exist.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Because in that sliver of time it doesn’t. And bring in much awareness into your experience as possible.
Bob: Where does this concept of the silver cord come from? I don’t even know where it comes from and is there any validity to it? Maybe you could explain what it is.
William: Well, it’s quite controversial. I and others had experienced it, but it’s not what people think. People have this almost childish attitude that the silver cord by the way it’s a Biblical phrase.
Bob: Okay.
William: It comes from the Bible where it’s mentioned. And it’s a connecting point, but it’s not a connecting point necessarily to the soul. It’s just a connecting point. It’s almost like, look at it more as a portal, an energy portal for the physical world to the next energy body. There needs to be a connecting point to bring in that energy to the biological machine that we operate.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But again, once you begin to have experiences beyond what I call the etheric, I’ve only witnessed the cord a couple of times and that’s because I was in my denser energy body. Once you move into other dimensional realities, the cord is no longer present. That’s what I have experienced.
Bob: Could this be what some people are describing as the tunnel?
William: I don’t think so.
Bob: No, different.
William: It’s an opening of a membrane between two dimensions.
Bob: Okay.
William: That’s our minds’ perception of the opening. That’s why there’s always a higher, this bright light. Because each successive dimension is a brighter light. It’s a higher vibratory light.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And that’s why when people enter this, what they’re doing is they are going through the membrane, I feel.
Bob: I see.
William: Again, that’s my perception of this.
Bob: Yeah.
William: But I’m sure it’s accurate.
Bob: Of course it is. Right from the get-go you have this first experience in your… which I think is… well, I’m not even going to say that because I was probably wrong. What I’m going to say is, I think it’s not that comment, but you see this man in a purple robe. I know you saw him a couple of times. Who do you think this man in a purple robe was that seems to be watching you as you’re having your outer body experience?
William: There’s no doubt this is a guide.
Bob: A guide.
William: I think all of us have some kind of helpers. I’m not talking about an angel or anything like that.
Bob: Yeah.
William: I’m just talking about all of us have helpers or friends, non-physical helpers that are there to assist us during OBEs, near-death experiences. There’s always someone else present that is there to assist us in this journey of consciousness because it’s a pivotal point in our lives for many of us when we have this experience. And it only make sense as a friend. We’ve been around. We’re a tunnel.
Bob: Yeah.
William: We’ve been around a long time.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And I think there is a support… it’s a wonderful support. Let say, community that assists people that are having this type of experiences. And it’s the same applies to NDEs and OBs. Now, in OBs guides will generally remain unseen and they don’t want to interfere with the natural process of your experience.
Bob: Okay.
William: But occasionally people do see, let’s just call them helpers.
Bob: Yeah, and in your very first one you see him, he’s like, “Oh, crap. How did he do that?”
William: Yeah, I think he didn’t expect me to see him because whatever. I’ll be honest the first time I saw someone standing there it scared me.
Bob: Yeah.
William: I’m just being totally honest because I was not expecting to have someone watching me in my experience, and that to me… now, it was also illuminating because I realized, “Oh my god, other people exist in this other reality.” My first experience was fear because it was so unexpected. But later as I had successive experiences, I began to get more comfortable. And the first thing I realized I need to overcome my own fear, that’s the biggest obstacle we have.
Bob: Yeah.
William: It’s so true in all, including me. You have to conquer your own fear.
Bob: Right.
William: And once you realize you are immortal when you have these experiences, that’s what really helps to get rid of the fear.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Because nothing can harm us.
Bob: Right.
William: So, what am I fearful of, just because something’s unusual?
Bob: Yeah.
William: Of course, it’s unusual. It’s in a non-physical reality created by thought. So, it’s going to be different than here.
Bob: Right. And even better it’s like this playground where you can just have all kinds of fun and you don’t have to worry about anything.
William: And it’s also a learning environment.
Bob: Totally.
William: Because our thoughts are projected back to us, so we are the teacher.
Bob: Yeah.
William: We’re always the teacher.
Bob: You also saw loved ones, deceased loved ones. I’m just curious, we don’t have a lot of time, but was those spontaneous or is it possible that you can set it up to see lost loved ones if you want to?
William: You can request to see loved ones and I’ll be talking about this at the afterlife conference.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Most of my experiences has been spontaneous. I met my mother who was deceased, my uncle and many others. Most of these experiences they come to you, once they realize that you are available. Remember once you leave your body you’re in their energy dimension and you’re available for contact.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And the rules have changed. My uncle came to me, my mother came to me and communicated with me face to face.
Bob: Yeah.
William: What was amazing is that when they died they were old, they were in their 70s most of the time and they were overweight. When I saw my mother she was about 24 years old, beautiful, young, vibrant. I mean, it was… but it was her.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And energetically it’s her.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Because you don’t communicate… everything is changed remember. There is no air molecules. You don’t communicate by vibrating vocal chords. You communicate by thought.
Bob: Right.
William: It’s very elegant. It’s very, very, very, let’s just say accurate. Not like this word symbols that we use in the physical world.
Bob: Yeah. And so, with that subject I’m just going to show everybody this book. Now, I’ve asked William if he would mind coming back another time. We can just talk about this because it’s so much information, and we can just talk about this. So, “Adventures in the Afterlife” his most recent book and is using his experiences with OBEs (out-of-body experiences) to learn about life after death. There’s so much to that, you had the diagnosis of cancer, you went to this healing environment. Oh my goodness, I can’t wait to talk about all that stuff. It’s fascinating, it’s filled with lessons and good information. People can find a lot about this stuff at your website astralinfo.org. It will be in the show notes below this video astralinfo.org and you said you’re going to speak in the afterlife conference this June 4-7?
William: Yes, I’ll be doing a 4-hour workshop on the first day of the conference at afternoon and also, I’ll be speaking at the conference on the next day, the 5th I believe it is.
Bob: Beautiful.
William: You’re one of the presenters at the afterlife conference.
Bob: Oh, that’s exciting. Well, Afterlife TV is an official sponsor of the Afterlife Conference. And it’s not even why I had you here, you’ve been on my list forever and finally I get around to it. And you do workshops at the Monroe Institute like we said. Anything else that you want to talk about?
William: No, I just have a new workshop called “Destination Higher Self.”
Bob: What’s that all about?
William: It’s about preparation and training for the afterlife.
Bob: Okay.
William: Practical guidance and tools, so that the individual is prepared to help loved ones or themselves in the transition we call death. Because death is illusion, it’s a transition of consciousness. I think, it’s so needed in today’s world.
Bob: Yeah. Well, I just lost my father-in-law, Melissa’s father just last week, tomorrow the services ends, and I will tell you it was a beautiful, peaceful, passing. He died at home with hospice coming. But really reminding me the necessity of my work, but the necessity of people learning like what you’re teaching in that conference. I highly recommend it because we’re all going to have someone who dies, or we’re going to go ourselves. So, it’s just one of these things that it’s important to everyone. It’s just you can’t get around it.
William: It is important. Hope is not an effective preparation for the afterlife. It’s not.
Bob: Yeah.
William: What else in life would you just hope things all work out? You plan your meals everyday.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Let’s plan our transition of consciousness. Let’s get educated, knowledgeable and create a personal plan. And that’s what I assist people to do.
Bob: Yeah.
William: Have your own plan and make it the best transition you could possibly be.
Bob: Yeah.
William: And move beyond the antiquated beliefs and obtain knowledge.
Bob: Well, yeah. It sounds so amazing that we even have this ability for us to not be taking advantage of it while we’re here, almost seems negligent.
William: Yes, in a way.
Bob: Doesn’t it? Yeah.
William: Yes it does.
Bob: Final words, any wisdom you want to leave us with or anything else? In 40 years of doing this, how has it changed you as a person? Are you different than you used to be?
William: Oh my god, if I can say one thing is that we have the capacity to obtain the answers. We no longer need to depend on archaic, dark age belief systems. We are spiritual powerful beings and we exist in every dimension of the universe. It’s up to us to become explorers of consciousness, and get off of the old belief and dependence upon this manipulative beliefs that dominate our society. Look around in our society today and you see what they’re doing.
Bob: Yeah.
William: They’re creating nothing, but death and destruction. They’re all flawed. We have to grow up spiritually and become mature spiritual explorers of consciousness. Otherwise we will always be, let’s just say, behind the eight ball when it comes to transition in our evolutionary cycle.
Bob: Wow, beautiful. Beautifully said again. Where am I? Adventures Beyond the Body: How to Experience Out-of-Body Travel – William Buhlman. And I thank you very much for being here. It’s been a pleasure and we are going to have you on again, so it won’t be goodbye. But we’ll say goodbye to all the audience. Thanks everybody for joining us and until next time.
William: Okay. Bye-bye.
Afterlife TV is presented by Afterlife Investigator & Psychic Medium Researcher Bob Olson, who is the author of Answers about the Afterlife: A Private Investigator’s 15-Year Research Unlocks the Mysteries of Life after Death.
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